By PF2K on Apr 20, 2019 at 7:10 PM
  1. PF2K

    PF2K Lead Artist | PvP Balance Team Lead
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    Greetings, fellow Celeste players!

    We are very excited to bring you the first new feature that is done completely from scratch by the Celeste Development Team, the Spartan Reforge.

    What is the Spartan Reforge, you say?

    As you know, most pieces of equipment in Age of Empires Online have varied stats. This means that when you find a piece of gear in loot chests, sometimes it can have lower stats than the item's base stats. Well, in case of legendary gear, you don't have to deal with that anymore! Now with the Spartan Forge, you can try your luck at getting better stats on your gear.

    SpartanReforgeIndicator.png
    - How does it work?
    First, you go to the Sparta Region. Then you can find the Spartan Forge. Click on the building to open the Reforge menu. Drag and drop your item from your inventory. There you will see your item's Power Level, which is an indicator of how close your item is towards its maximum possible stats.
    ReforgeUIGuide.png
    If you're feeling lucky, press the Reforge button to have a shot at re-rolling your item's stats!

    - What currency do I need to use to reforge my gear?
    The Spartan Forge uses Empire Points. The cost for reforging each piece of gear goes up every time you do it, and it is tracked separately for each item.

    Once you reforge your item, it can no longer be traded.

    - Can I reforge pieces of gear I have already equipped?
    Yes you can!

    - Does reforging guarantee that I will get better stats every time?

    No - every time you reforge your item, it will completely reroll the stats on it, meaning that you can get better or worse stats every time you do it, and it isn't linked to your previous attempts at all.

    - Can I reforge all kinds of gear?
    No - Only Legendary gear can be reforged, and there are some Legendary items that cannot be reforged due to having non-varied stats. These include:

    • Cyprus Legendary Items (bought from the store at Cyprus)
    • Alliance Gear (Delian League, Council of Imhotep and Legion of Carthage Stores' Legendary items)
    • Event Gear (Zahhak's Sword of the Undying, Ice King's Gear, and future items)
    • Questline Completion Rewards (such as Athena's Long Spear, rewarded to every player for completing the Athens Questline, and the upcoming Norse Pack's Questline reward)


    What do you think about the new Reforge feature? What kind of other new features are you looking forward to? Does any of the upcoming new features showcased at our Development Roadmap for 2019 get you excited? Let us know in the comments below!

    Thanks, and see you in the game!

    - Celeste Development Team
     
    #1 PF2K, Apr 20, 2019 at 7:10 PM
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2019
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Comments

Discussion in 'News' started by PF2K, Apr 20, 2019.

    1. lukipr0

      lukipr0 Spearman

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      i say let people hell-bent on spending their EP for reforges do just that. but not at ever-increasing EP cost while odds remain the same.
       
    2. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      We intentionally chose cheap prices at first rather than a flat rate higher than 250 EP. We don’t want to encourage players to reforge almost everything.

      1. Grab a badly nerfed version of an otherwise powerful item.
      2. Pay 250 and roll the dice.
      3. If the item is worth using now, then use it. If it’s not worth using, then buy another badly nerfed version of the same item on the market for cheap and try reforging that one. We just created a better market for nerfed legs. Use it. Or ignore that and just chase your dreams into an EP black hole.
       
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    3. ByFstugan

      ByFstugan Champion

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      Why would it be a joke? I argued before the release it was a good idea with Gear Reforge but that some details in it's format was less good, one of them being the size of the increasing cost. After release it's obvious in the tradechat that it's pretty much what all think that I've seen said anything about it, and it was pretty much the only topic the first hours here after the patch.

      I have build about 20 Legendary crafted items and got just a couple boosted ones - for an insane amount in material cost. I've now reforged all of them (besides them I sold) and got 2 boosted items and alot of more nerfed to avarege once for a rather high extra cost in EP. To me the random generator seems to favor nerfed results with a factor of at least 2:1 compared to boosted - I dunno if I got silly bad luck, but I talked to others with same experience. The reforge seem to be on the same page here when it comes to my bad luck. Is it really even odds to get boosted as nerfed?

      I get your points and in general I think you're right, but with the insane amount of work, material and coins I've put i.e to my legendary crafting items and the bad luck I had with both making and reforging them I even more think the cost increases to much and to fast - and this goes especially for the legendary crafted items. Perhaps I could argue for my case especially for the legendary crafted items only instead, and keep things as they is on the dropable items and it might sound more reasonable in your ears?

      It's not like you don't have to worry about us running out of EP fast enough, because we will, but some items is just so expensive to begin with (leg craft.) that there will NEVER be any cheap versions to buy on the market after Reforge has entered the game.
       
    4. Exclusive0r

      Exclusive0r Hippikon

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      @lukipr0 ^^ This :):)

      Seriously, I like it just how it is, well maybe I would prefer 100 RP for next try but then after reading Andy P I kinda agree with how it is.

      Lets, put this in perspective, like the man says "If you can't afford to lose (the bet), don't place it". I'm going out on a limb here but......
      I am beginning to think that, if you have to rely on small changes in Gear to win , then maybe I would practice a bit more ???.. In the Original game I was saw someone stream Leg Soloi co op without any gear either of them ..(I think it maybe still on You Tube).

      [EDIT: For clarity - the above about Gear is a General point and not applicable to Collectors, just players, the point is Gear is only 1 element of a "Strategy" Game so I practice w/o it sometimes :):)]

      Now that's interesting ..^^ :Thumbsup

      Anyway you can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time ... but you can't please all of the people all of the time

      So I think it's another great addition .... thanks Celeste :):):):)

      @rtsgamer ... you must have a lot of EP :):):), I have a lot and you are way better than me o_Oo_Oo_O
       
      #24 Exclusive0r, Apr 21, 2019 at 5:25 PM
      Last edited: Apr 21, 2019
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    5. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      I’ve read the entire trade chat today since launch (it feeds into discord for us). Respectfully, the only thing I’ve seen from it is that a bunch of people didn’t read the reforge details closely and when some dude mindlessly spent 5k EP reforging the same thing over and over everyone decided that proved the reforge was broken. It’s not broken, it’s just being used wrong. If it were cheap to reforge items, nobody would quest anymore.

      We have a duty to leave the game better than we found it. If we created a Santa Claus machine that gave everybody everything they wanted for free, we would break the damn game.
       
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    6. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      Thanks @Exclusive0r. One of our intentional objectives with the reforge is to allow players to more easily find buyers for nerfed legs. This is obviously an indirect effect and not something we explained at first, but it’s nice some players are seeing that.
       
    7. Exclusive0r

      Exclusive0r Hippikon

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      ^^^ It would soon become boring ...
       
    8. lukipr0

      lukipr0 Spearman

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      @Exclusive0r

      Du interpretierst das grundverkehrt, tut mir leid. Ich hab einfach bestimmte Vorstellungen davon, wie mein Gear aussehen soll. Das bedeutet nicht, dass ich darauf angewiesen bin. Ich bin ein Sammler. Bitte Ball flach halten, danke..
       
    9. Exclusive0r

      Exclusive0r Hippikon

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      @lukipr0
      We both made an interpretation based on what was written down, I can only do that. I think its lost in translation, I am English... so I just read what I see. I had no idea you were a collector, it doesn't say that and it is not possible to know
      with my skills :eek::eek:, . sry for that , o_O
      However you missed "then maybe I would practice a bit more"
      "I "means "me" practising more not you LoL o_O. you can collect :):):)
      "Eine einzige Nuss rappelt nicht im Sacke"
       
    10. Jeinx

      Jeinx Moderator
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      Solution to everything :D
      Players wanting to use the reforge to make all their gear max stats should not use the reforge.
      Players that want to save their EP for the long awaited Celeste weekly rotation items should not use the reforge.
      Players that have a nerfed item equipped and think paying 250ep as a gamble is a better deal than paying full price for a whole new buffed version, then vendor the old one, should use the reforge.
      Players that get a great deal on a good item with terrible stats and want to try their luck for 250 ep to make it better, should use the reforge.
      I look at it like this. 250ep, and I get a garuanteed drop of an item that I want specifically. I used to replaced nerfed items I equpped early on with better versions, and flush the old ones down the vendor. Now I may try a reforge first :p
       
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    11. ByFstugan

      ByFstugan Champion

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      This is, as I think lukipr0 mumbo jumbo'ed in german, a strawman that has nothing to do with anything said, or meant. It's not like some decimals of a percentage, or a few percentage even, in gear makes us manage maps we otherwise fail on - to even think that is a case made is more of a sign of needing to practice a bit in the world of reading comprehension I'd say.

      The topics here is more about the suitable level for cost when doing the second or more reforge - and if there are other levels or ways to solve that which is simply better in some way. In general the devs has made a really good thing here and the basics in what they say is sound and good in the longer perspective.

      The game(s) you talk about was likelly from SafeBase which did such things (I recall Marion), he was a rockstar in AoEo both PVE and PVP but never came back with Celeste - I tried to drag him in, he said it looked intresting but to my knowledge he never downloaded it.
       
    12. ByFstugan

      ByFstugan Champion

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      When it comes to dropable items I tend to agree more than I did in my first posts - though mine and others experience was only with the new silly expensive legendary craftable that was our world of experience and base for discussion, and from that the arguments started. I've realized I do agree with you about those things, but that is limited to dropable items and excludes the new craftable legendary items from which perspecive my last post were made from.

      I REALLY think it's FAR to often they get's crafted nerfed, and I dunno if I just had bad luck more than others, but it hasn't been kind to me. If me and others with this bad luck (as I had with 95% of my crafting as well as most of my reforge) see this high investments result in something boring or in some case even worse than other rare items that you can't even sell for 1k, it's a really really sad and high investment for nothing. This can now be adjusted with Reforge, which is VERY good.

      Though if you got bad luck, as I had, even with the reforge - I think this bad luck could at least get three rolls before the cost-increase comes to them. We with such bad luck in the rolls with them items will anyhow have paid more than all others have done for same gear in the end due to that bad luck, and even with three rolls for base price we could see in rtsgamers case that even twice that can still result in not one single boosted item.

      I understand it could be to easy to fix other dropable über items, but to many of the leg craftables is so low that it's even hard to get even one version that's better than the rare gear they compete with (like the Aegean Contract which I made 6-7 of and had NO really boosted one at all (as far as I recall one base and rest below, and at least 3 max nerfed).

      So, I suggest that Leg craftable items due to their very very high cost has a couple extra runs of the base price before the "EP black hole" starts to devour you, as Andy P so elegant said it ;D

      About the rest items I say you are right and I agree with your reasoning.
       
    13. Jeinx

      Jeinx Moderator
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      Originally craftables were not going to be included. We made the decision to add them, so players had an option for the bad stat craftables. All aside, at least it's an option. But yeah, I get the frustration having a bad craft, then a bad reforge :eek:
       
    14. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      I’m not sure there’s much we can do about bad luck. We program the game to assign an equal chance for stats to be buffed or nerfed. This applies to both leg craftables and reforges. There’s no boogeyman hiding in the code. It’s just coin flips. Statistics have a natural tendency to appear sentient, but they aren’t. On average, for every nerfed item, there is an equal and opposite buffed item. I’d encourage everyone to write down and track their results. As your sample size increases, so will your tendency to equal out.
       
    15. Tinendir

      Tinendir Spearman

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      Thanks for this New Feature. It's really cool. Too bad we can't use it with Epic and Rare Gear as some of the best Gears Ingame are not legendary.

      I tried the Forge on about 10 Items. Some of them received a very nice Boost, while for some it was a waste of EP. It's gambling really.

      250 EP for first Reforge seems ok to me for some very valuable items. For most of Leg Items, it simply don't worth it.
      As for next Reforges (500 EP and more) i highly recommend to not use them as the cost is crazy expensive. Unless you really have shitons of EP.

      Last but not least : Only reforge very nerfed Items. This will avoid you a lot of disappointment.
       
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    16. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      Sure. But bear in mind, that’s likely an over-reported and unlikely result.

      1. Craft a leg item. 50 percent of the time the item is buffed. If so, the item will be used and nobody will complain on the forum.
      2. Of the 50 percent of nerfed leg items, only the very nerfed ones will be reforged.
      3. Of those reforged items, 50 percent will end up buffed. If so, those items will be used and nobody will complain on the forum.
       
    17. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      This chap has figured it out! We aren’t creating game changing content here. When we are about to release something that completely changes the game, we will tell you.
       
    18. ByFstugan

      ByFstugan Champion

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      I don't know if it's possible check my history of leg craftable, but feel free if you can - I am not exaggerating. Below I only count the most important stat, which to 90% is the one all is looking at. During the making of all I was time after time after time amazed that I got "nerfed again, and really nerfed also" - and I only two times remember a real feeling of getting a boosted one, though there were a couple more close to it. Together they were very few in a big pile though.

      Aegean contract, I did 6-7 pieces of it, I got one 8.8, which is base - which also is on pair with most rare versions I had before - and rest was nerfed, all of them and none was boosted.

      Xerxes arrows, I've done like 11-12 of them and got one max, two one from max, a couple around base and several nerfed and 3 max nerf.

      Runic Armoring, done about 10 of them, got no max, one 0.1 from max and then I'm not sure how many base or just a little above, but by far I had most nerfed, and at least 3 max nerf.

      I have reforged most of them today once...

      After refoging Aeagans, I got one max, one 8,7 and one max nerf (8,4). I had sold the rest before for down to 30k each before I knew about Reforge would come. Regret, yes.

      Xerxes I did most of and I made one max and reforged another. Besides that I got 3 one from max after reforge some less intresting and in total I've seen at least 3 or more max nerf.

      Runic I reforged 5 of the 6 I had left that was nerfed or maybe even around base. The new results on those 5 was as best 12,9 and then 12,6 - then two nerfed (12,4 + 12,3) and a max nerf (11,9). So on all making and reforge rolls I got about 4 max nerfed, once decent and one good and no max here.

      There is an heavy overload on nerfed samples in all my making and reforging, and a pretty large number of max nerf and only one max in making and two in reforging.

      Just saying this since you more or less accusing me of lying - if you can prove me wrong feel free to check logs - I'm not. I wouldn't have made any max and missed it. At most I can have a number of slightly boosted ones that slipped my mind, of that I'm not as sure.
       
    19. Andy P XIII

      Andy P XIII Moderator
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      I am not accusing you of lying at all. I’m just saying that with stats strange things happen.
       
    20. ByFstugan

      ByFstugan Champion

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      Indeed :)

      And :(

      So :eek:

      Or... o_O
       
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